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Carnifex Configuration

PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 8:14 pm
Is this a bad configuration for two new carnifexs I am building and deploying?

Base price 85 points

Ext. Cara - +1 save
Ad. Glans - +1 WS
Enh Senses - +1 BS
Ad Glans - +1 I
Scy Talons - +1 Attack
Tox Sacs +1 Strength
Venom Cannon

167 points roughly

I want them to be able to fight but mostly hit tanks, skimmers and dreds with long range fire power and stop them from shooting.

Is Toxic miasma worth getting to help fight off the power fists?

Re: Carnifex Configuration

PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 1:40 am
by The Gunslinger
If your primary purpose is shooting armor, then instead of the STalons, give it a barbed strangler since it's S8. That's 2 S10 shots, and 1 S8 every turn.

Also, even though they're expensive, more people are digging the +1 T & W and regeneration. The regen is justified even more if you have the extra wound. The extra toughness, protects you a bit from power fists, needing 3's instead of 2's to wound, as well as anything else that's S8 to 5

Re: Carnifex Configuration

PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 2:13 am
by -thx10050
For shooty Carnifexes, I believe that, as Lou said, a Strangler is far more useful than Talons. You only want to be assaulting with Gunfexes as a last resort or as clean up once the enemy's been whittled down. +1 Toughness and +1 Wound are definitely useful: four wounds makes a Fex go down too easily, five wounds and people begin to ignore it. Toughness really helps with having five wounds as well and once you stick them in cover, that's something that's pretty hard to shift through shooting alone. I don't personally believe Carapace, Initiative, WS, and Miasma are worth it on a Gunfex; save the CC upgrades for your Flyrant, if you have one. Spinebanks are useful though: spine fist (more dakka) and flesh hooks all in one.

I also don't think Regen is worth it on a Gunfex for its points cost. Gunfexes should be high strength shooters (Toxin Sacs is personal preference; I don't have them on my Gunfexes to save points on the weapons themselves). My own Gunfexes are more expensive than yours though (+1 Wound, Toughness, etc, adds up, along with a VC and BS), so if points cost is an issue feel free to mix up upgrades as you'll think you need them.

Hope that helps.

Re: Carnifex Configuration

PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 9:56 am
If you have a VC and BS, they need to be shot at the same target right? No split shooting. So if you effectively stop something with the VC, then the BS is waisted for that turn.

Re: Carnifex Configuration

PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 11:54 am
by -thx10050
Keep in mind you've only got two shots with the VC anyways, hitting on a 4+. I'd rather have the extra shot in there from the Strangler than an extra close combat attack.

Also, I just realized that Toxin Sacs are unnecessary if you're trying to up the Gunfex's shooting strength: Venom Cannons are +2 strength anyways (making them strength 10 for a Carnifex) and Barbed Stranglers are -1 to strength and are max strength 8. In fact, at strength 9, I see no reason for Toxin Sacs at all on a Carnifex.

Re: Carnifex Configuration

PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 3:43 am
I don't think you can look at a Carnifex as just a shooting or HTH platform. My past experience has been that they shoot long distance as they advance, then once stuck in or without anything to shoot, they go into HTH. So I can see a venomcannon/Scyth Tal combo being effective in that role. This way they can be affective the entire game. What if you go against all infantry armies?

Re: Carnifex Configuration

PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 9:06 am
by -thx10050
Sure, you can't look at a Carnifex as solely one or the other, but to try and make it equally good in both roles seems a mistake to me. It's still a strength 9 Monstrous Creature in close combat with a high toughness and a good number of wounds depending. And it's not as if you're sending a lone Carnifex into a squad one at a time. That would be a mistake. And if you're up against mostly infantry, the Strangler becomes even more useful, with a large blast template and pinning.

It all really comes down to personal preference. In terms of tactics, from what I've read about Godzilla army lists, I think I'd prefer my five Carnifexes to shoot first and then assault towards the end of the game, or to clean up alongside the two Tyrants and six Raveners.

If you think your Carnifexes are fine as-is, then keep them that way. Not the way I'd play them, but what does it matter if they work for you and your style of play?

Re: Carnifex Configuration

PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 5:25 am
by The Gunslinger
The consensus nowadays seems to be that carnies should be anti-infantry shooters, as well as anti-tank. Most especially in a godzilla list. I think what triggered the notion is the dakka-fex with 6 TL, S6, reroll wound shots at 18"(?). It's not going to nail heavy tanks, but you should have a mix anyway. So with that in mind, the VC & BS isn't bad.

Similar to what Dave mentioned, the extra attack isn't going to kill as many points as a barbed strangler would. What if there isn't armor to pop? You absolutely must soften up units as you're approaching, at least with a godzilla list.

Lastly, if you go with the extra wound, the regen is so worth it, as it adds on another wound to try to regen from every turn

Re: Carnifex Configuration

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 11:39 am
This carnifex configuration is part of a regular army list of gaunts and large creatures,typically 2 Hts, 2 carnifexs, TWs, 5 broods gaunts and GS. Normally I need each large creature to pack a VC to hold off tanks, skimmers and dreds while we move up to HTH.

Re: Carnifex Configuration

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 9:11 pm
by Flavius Infernus
The dakkadakka article on configuring carnifexes in this version of the codex is an especially good one: