Thoughts from a long-time player

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Re: Thoughts from a long-time player

Postby mattbird » Thu May 14, 2009 9:24 pm

thanks! love the knifers idea...
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Re: Thoughts from a long-time player

Postby Larro » Fri May 15, 2009 1:26 am

But it is my guess you never actually played Skaven warlocks for any length of time.


1, while my name isn't Larry The Rat, that doesn't mean I've never played Skaven. In fact, I played Skaven for a long enough time to realize the broken-ness of the book and the lack of fun my regular opponents had, which was when I quickly sold them off.

2, that said, one of our long time players used Skaven religiously in their prime time era for about 2 years after the books release, and I played it many, many times, as did much of our Club. Warlocks > many mages out there, even if they do ultimately hurt themselves along the way.

Let me see if I can slow it down a bit.


Please don't slow down on my account, I'm a pretty intelligent individual.

I am proposing we increase the magic potential, but with that kind of power, you have to have some drawback to go with it.


Do you know what I'm proposing? That my mage doesn't stop becoming a mage. How's that for a novel idea? Give me the option of taking MAGIC, or NOT MAGIC, not some in-between BS that is potentially completely ineffectual. If you want them to be fighter-mages, do it Warrior Priest Bound 4 style with a limited spell chart, nothing game breaking, and call it a day. Give the Big Guy a slightly better spell chart, and presto, Bound spells without too much redundancy and nothing zanny or OTT, i.e. keeps tactics involved for BOTH players, and doesn't just hose 1 guy because he rolled a 1 on Turn 1. The odds of rolling a 1/6 is significantly greater than a MISCAST on 2 dice or 3 dice, and almost no result on the Miscast Chart is as bad as "hey Mage, you're not a Mage anymore. Killself."

And now you are left with a fighty character with a magic weapon. It should probably be changed that it does work that time, but runs out afterwards. Like most bound items work.


"Most" bounds is disingenuous. Tomb Kings, Empire prayers/Altar, Bangstick, Jaguar Charm, Staff of Ravening, and so on and so forth = no exhaust. Some things do exhaust. Do you know what doesn't exhaust? A mage's ability to be a mage. How about we nix that, tone down the power of the spells a little bit if you're not fine with their potency, or better yet, stop changing core game mechanics and keep casting done with dice?

- Larry
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Re: Thoughts from a long-time player

Postby Garrett » Fri May 15, 2009 1:35 am

Just to interject, but I rolled two out of three of my Priest's I points in wounds today (didn't take the +1 I item as I wanted the cleasing flare bound) in four turns of rolling, 1 of them on Turn 1, and I rolled out 4 more dice out of morbid curiosity and would've turned to stone. So it's a legit potential problem.
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Re: Thoughts from a long-time player

Postby BenTheRat » Fri May 15, 2009 9:41 am

@Larry, I don't think we are that far off. I did play Skaven for years. Have since they were introduced in 2nd ed. All the way up through 7th. While they were powerful, I don't think they were broken unless you were a serious powergamer. If you stuck to the 2 rule you were fine.

Now lets get back to CDs. Problem is, the Daemon dudes, aren't wizards and you want them to be. In fact my suggestion was we give them 1 casting as a HP as well, that didn't run out.
But if we are going to play the -1 Init on every 1, then I think they really need their init to increase by 1. Make the Daemon guys I3, and high priest, I4.
And to change it so they could take either a Daemonsword of unlimitied value, or take 50 points of magic items (including arcane and daemonswords).

@Garrett, that is why I said every GT player who runs a HP, will take the +1 Initiative item. Rolling 2 1's is just average over the course of a game. And if you do it early you are screwed. Take the +1 Initiative and they will make it through 80% of their games with no problem.

Maybe the key is:
1. Raise the HP and DS Initiative by 1. (raise points a few)
2. Give the DS guy a 1 casting similar to the Priest.

or
3. Go back to the sorcerers as before.

Oh and sorry if I was being disingenuous. I was referring to the bound items that do run out. Their spell goes off and then stops working. Unlike the daemonswords. I wasn't trying to say most bound items run out.
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Re: Thoughts from a long-time player

Postby Larro » Fri May 15, 2009 10:52 am

BenTheRat wrote:Maybe the key is:
1. Raise the HP and DS Initiative by 1. (raise points a few)
2. Give the DS guy a 1 casting similar to the Priest.

or
3. Go back to the sorcerers as before.


Both suggestions are OK by me. If Init was upped 1, and the DS had a casting like the big guy that didn't run out on a 1 but simply failed to cast on a 1, we'd be in good shape I think.

- Larry
"Just being born means you've lost to Larro. Or haven't you gotten the memo yet?" - Nidal

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Re: Thoughts from a long-time player

Postby MantisZero » Fri May 15, 2009 12:55 pm

I agree, the Smiths spell should still go off even on the roll of a 1 then cease to work again just like other bounds in the game.
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