Seemingly Slippery Slope

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Seemingly Slippery Slope

Postby Sergrum » Thu May 14, 2009 7:04 pm

I don't want to be a debbie downer or anything, and certainly love the effort being put into this project, but i almost feel as if we are starting to go down a slipperly slope. Mainly, this book was aimed at being a low to mid tier book, which i think is a good goal since we dont want the players themselves making the game more OTT. (we let Adam Hall do that with daemons). So here are a few of my concerns.

New Rules- Warhammer has lot of similarities amongest armies, and similar unit types work the same way. Ex: all chariots cause impacts with +1 for scythes.

Concern- There are a couple special rules with this army which are unlike anything else. Rabble getting full unit upgrades for a set cost, the entire magic system, daemonitems, and even the daemoneater impact hits after the charge thingie. While some are good for the game, as i've addressed before throwing in so many new rules might be bad for the army overall.

Talking about each unit- This one is odd, cause it's the first draft so i dont think it is apparent as to what is going to happen. Basically we are all commenting on everything and trying to get it changed to be just right. We want every unit to be perfectly cost, with no fat, and perfectly viable in use. When in the warhammer world there are crappy units which cost too many/too little points.I think as we comment and change rules this army is going to be formed into this perfectly pointed every unit is good army that ends up being top tier because all these GT players are making rules for the units they want. Just looking over the inital posts, all people want is cheaper points, better armour, and more special rules.

All i say is, dont lose sight of what this project is about which is making CD a viable army to take to tournaments. A GT crowd will make an army that suits what the GT crowd wants to use in tournies.

That being said, i think this army has potential to be super shooty/magicy making for a pretty dull game, but i guess its up to the player to restrct himself. Again good work so far, and while i have no intentions of playing CD i hope the book turns out right.
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Re: Seemingly Slippery Slope

Postby mattbird » Thu May 14, 2009 9:26 pm

Thanks Alex. I agree on all points, and share the exact concerns.
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Re: Seemingly Slippery Slope

Postby GeneralofChaos13 » Fri May 15, 2009 11:30 am

My main concern, is that this army could go to far away from the Games-Workshop blueprint for Chaos Dwarfs. I do not see the hardcore CD player being happy with these new special rules. It's like a major overhaul, when the army might just need a tune up to compete in 7th edition. So I agree with Alex on this one as your close to a slippery slope.

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Re: Seemingly Slippery Slope

Postby gjnoronh » Fri May 15, 2009 12:29 pm

I agree with Alex.

I think it's a great work of both love for the game and creativity (what else would I expect from Kevin)

But I had the exact same concerns reading through it.

A revamp around the current list with a few new bits great - but keep it similar to other armies.

I think a mix of WoC and dwarves should be what we're shooting for game play wise (okay a couple of gobbo things in too) and this is really instead very uncharted territory.
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Re: Seemingly Slippery Slope

Postby Larro » Sat May 16, 2009 2:37 pm

Agree with all comments except those about the Demoneater. It works like a steam tank in subsequent turns. Wtf is so hard to understand about impact hits?

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Re: Seemingly Slippery Slope

Postby KevinC » Sat May 16, 2009 5:16 pm

All concerns noted.

But please, what I really need to hear is how this army actually functions in actual games. Please go play and tell me what happens....


Kevin out
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Re: Seemingly Slippery Slope

Postby Matt » Sun May 17, 2009 7:09 pm

Larro wrote:Agree with all comments except those about the Demoneater. It works like a steam tank in subsequent turns. Wtf is so hard to understand about impact hits?

- Larry

So it doesn't do any hits in your opponents close combat phase?
Oh, I guess it isn't all that much like a steam tank after all...

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Re: Seemingly Slippery Slope

Postby Dedwrekka » Mon May 18, 2009 7:21 am

As a Chaos Dwarf player I want to say a couple things:

If I wanted to play WoC or Dwarfs, I'd play those armies and proxy in my Chaos Dwarfs.

If I wanted a boring army list with little to no variation in army construction, choices or special rules, I'd go back to Ravening Hordes.

I like the new list.
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