V4 Daemonsmith comments here!

Moderators: KevinC, mattbird

V4 Daemonsmith comments here!

Postby mattbird » Tue Aug 04, 2009 2:59 pm

yo!
jer732 wrote:Birdoff makes me want to rage quit life
mattbird
 
Posts: 5595
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2008 3:25 pm

Re: V4 Daemonsmith comments here!

Postby elrodogg » Tue Aug 04, 2009 3:08 pm

So the rules for these guys are fine, but the wording is confusing. From the reading of it, it looks like the stat boost is part of the bound spell. Break it up. Remove the Bound 5 from the stat boost section, and apply it to the second paragraph detailing the spell casting.

Regarding rules: I would allow for a daemonsmith to default to the first choice of the spell lore if they want (so they aren't stuck with a spell that's useless if they roll it). Since these troops are essentially combat characters, I would also change the chart to someting like this:
1,2= +1 WS
3,4= +1 WS, STR
5,6= +1 WS, STR, ATT
Fast, like kittens with jetpacks.
User avatar
elrodogg
 
Posts: 5401
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:21 pm
Location: Brooklyn

Re: V4 Daemonsmith comments here!

Postby mikkjel » Tue Aug 04, 2009 5:54 pm

I disagree with the daemonsmith rolling up the default spell, tbh. Such is the nature of daemons. I also see it as a problem that one army could have so many reliable bound spells, I know a lot of people will have a big problem facing 3 bound spell level 5 RoBI casts if they also lose up to 3 dispel dice in their opponents magic phase. I think it might be an idea to tone down the bound level to 4 or 3, or possibly take it out of a common daemon pool (although this might be a bit much), so that one daemon smith will have pl7, two will have two pl5 and 3 will have pl3 or something to that effect.

EDIT: or you can make the daemon blade like an unlimited power stone as such, casts a spell on two dice but gives a s5 hit on any double.
mikkjel
 
Posts: 43
Joined: Tue May 12, 2009 3:24 pm

Re: V4 Daemonsmith comments here!

Postby Garrett » Wed Aug 05, 2009 1:45 am

I think it may've gone a bit unnoticed, but I really like the option of mounting the smith in a daemoneater. I think if you're going to keep them toned down in comparison to other chariots, they needed to have another way into the list that didn't compete with bull centaurs/bolt throwers/obsidian guard. I've got a list I'll be playtesting on Thursday that's heavy daemonsmith, let's see how it goes.
Garrett
 
Posts: 207
Joined: Sat May 02, 2009 7:42 pm

Re: V4 Daemonsmith comments here!

Postby Aves » Wed Aug 05, 2009 6:51 am

I have a technical question.

Since Deamonsmith is not a wizard, when selecting his bound spells from lores of magic lists, at the moment he CAN NOT change any spell to first on the list, as model would have to be a wizard be able to do so. Is it intentional to reduce possibility of having spell barage (3 deamonsmiths with fireballs or 3 lore of meta spells) or was the precise wording omissed?
Aves
 
Posts: 94
Joined: Wed May 27, 2009 2:49 pm

Re: V4 Daemonsmith comments here!

Postby mattbird » Wed Aug 05, 2009 8:51 pm

I'm sure it is intentional on Kevin's part, but --

I think we should change it so that he can default the spell as a normal wizard could.
jer732 wrote:Birdoff makes me want to rage quit life
mattbird
 
Posts: 5595
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2008 3:25 pm

Re: V4 Daemonsmith comments here!

Postby Border Reiver » Thu Aug 06, 2009 8:26 am

The army list for these guys needs to eliminate the option for them to take any magic item up to 50pts, since they already have a magic weapon.
Border Reiver
 
Posts: 106
Joined: Wed May 13, 2009 11:55 am

Re: V4 Daemonsmith comments here!

Postby Larro » Thu Aug 06, 2009 11:12 am

mattbird wrote:I'm sure it is intentional on Kevin's part, but --

I think we should change it so that he can default the spell as a normal wizard could.


I 100% agree. It's been clear all along that Coleman hates magic, hates Wizards, hates Dwarfs with magic, etc., but from a game-balance and utility perspective, this needs to happen. Empire Priests get 5 Prayers, all of which are good, but at different times. They at least know them all. A Demonsmith gets 1 spell, with obvious potential, but also with a prohibitive drawback in the event he cannot default. 1 or 2 bad spells on your Demonsmiths, and your entire Magic phase is unfairly crippled.

I mean honestly, how game breaking is it to default to a S4 magic missile, when these guys were walking around with S5 magic missiles in the last edition???

- Larry
"Just being born means you've lost to Larro. Or haven't you gotten the memo yet?" - Nidal

"Larry was right. I know he never gets tired of hearing that." - Canterman
User avatar
Larro
 
Posts: 3296
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:52 pm

Re: V4 Daemonsmith comments here!

Postby KevinC » Thu Aug 06, 2009 4:26 pm

It's been clear all along that Coleman hates magic, hates Wizards, hates Dwarfs with magic, etc


------------This is completely untrue, and even if it were, my goal is balance.

It is powerful in it own right that Daemonsmiths are able to cast high level spells (doom&darkness, wall of fire, etc) automatically at power level 5. Other wizards *attempt* to cast these spells, Daemonsmiths cast them auto, that is pretty potent.

Kevin out
Common Goblins iz da best!!

Check out my Gobbos at:http://z3.invisionfree.com/Orc__Goblin_Warpath/index.php?showtopic=28856

'I am the son of Aenarion, and where my blade falls, death follows.'
- Malekith, Prince of Nagarythe
User avatar
KevinC
 
Posts: 2293
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2008 1:18 pm

Re: V4 Daemonsmith comments here!

Postby Larro » Thu Aug 06, 2009 4:39 pm

Okay, well, what you've effectively done is ensured 99% of Demonsmiths select their Spells from the Lore of Fire, because that Lore is the only Lore without a truly "dead" spell, as even Flaming Sword is viable in a Demonsmith's hands.

Death has 2 spells which are entirely miserable and 100% situational, and the same is true of Metal.

There's a reason Wizards get 2 spells, and can always default to 1. Note that every Default spell is useful. The same is not true for spells beyond the 1st.

Again, you had these guys rolling around with S5 bound Fireballs for 3 versions of this list, and NOW you decide defaulting to a S4 fireball is somehow off-limits? You make no sense.

- Larry
"Just being born means you've lost to Larro. Or haven't you gotten the memo yet?" - Nidal

"Larry was right. I know he never gets tired of hearing that." - Canterman
User avatar
Larro
 
Posts: 3296
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:52 pm

Next

Return to Characters

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron