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Re: V3 Annihilator comments here!

PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2009 6:52 am
by mattbird
Hi Alric- as long as a single model is within the 12" range of the front rank of the annihilator unit, every model in the target unit is a potential target.

so in this example:

For example - If the rear rank of the target enemy unit is 13" or more from the front rank of the shooting blunderbuss unit are they potential hits ?

yes, they are potential hits.

Re: V3 Annihilator comments here!

PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2009 8:48 am
by Border Reiver
You know - the more we try to "fix" the fire zone of the blunderbuss, the more I come to appreciate the RH rules.

What is so OTT about the template that is the fire zone?

Right now with the official V3 rules we can have a weapon with a 12" range that can hit models out past its max range because the front rank of the unit is within 12". WTF? Maybe my dislike for the current incarnations and "fixes" is that I've been playing CDs with blunderbusses for about 13 years and the fire zone is something I learned very quickly. the one thing I do not want to lose is the Move and Fire rule. Back in 5th ed the blunderbuss was move or fire and let me tell you that a M3 army with short range Move OR Fire weapons shoots less than it does now. I used to see the blunderbuss unit as a slightly moveable minefield.

Re: V3 Annihilator comments here!

PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2009 8:56 am
by allanmcnab
All, missile units are able to hit people outside the max range of the unit if one model of the target is within range. This is not a difference. It is assumed that the guys in back move forward to allow themselves to be shot. :D

Re: V3 Annihilator comments here!

PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2009 11:21 am
by Fool
Dunno if this has come up yet, but what if only some of the models in the front rank are in range?

Re: V3 Annihilator comments here!

PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:40 pm
by mattbird
lol, in which version of the rules?

in the printed V3 version, all models in the front rank must be within 12" to use concentrated volley.

Re: V3 Annihilator comments here!

PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2009 2:09 pm
by allanmcnab
What I was talking about was the need for only 1 figure in the target unit to be in range of the firing unit even though the entire target unit could be killed, rather than the firing unit only being only partially within range of the target unit. :)

Re: V3 Annihilator comments here!

PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:39 pm
by Alric
Anger Worm wrote:Two versions of the shooting is overly complicated. I also dislike the fact that a 12" range gun, if within range of a single model, can now hit an entire unit. I encountered this when a single skink in woods could be seen by the front rank of blunderbuss, and though the rest of the unit was out of range (up to approximately 20" away) all 10 got hit. This seemed just odd and illogical.

Simple fix:

-Eliminate the "thrown weapon" aspect entirely. They have 1 gun, it should work 1 way.
-12" range should mean 12" range. When firing the gun, you measure range from the front rank of the buss unit. Plus 1 strength to the weapon per full additional rank in the unit (as is now). Pick a target within 12". Any models in range (within 12") are hit on a 4+ (no move or range penalties). For stand and shoot you could simply hit the front rank, or do d6 shots vs skirmishers.

This will still hammer rank and file, it's great against skirmishers, but it's not fiddly - you measure 12" just like you would any other shooting attack, and everything in that target unit is hit within that range. It's actually got a lot of potential when used in conjunction with the movement bound.

If using this rule I would consider adding armour piercing.

Well after play testing people are questioning the v.3 rules that allow the blunderbusses to reach models in a unit more than 12" away, if you are going to change it I would suggest something more intuitive than v.3 rules.
I suggest keeping the rules simple, start with the weapons basic profile along with a weapon range, doing this will give a you a basic rule to use in any situation.

Blunderbuss - Weapon Range 12" , Strength S3+1 per rank max S5 , Save as per strength, modify to hit for cover only. This will get you through any encounter.

Then add the blunderbuss special shooting rules. Either keep the original fire zone rules or a fire in 3 ranks rule. They both do about the same damage just tweak the point cost for weapon. If you go with the fire in 3 ranks rule then I suggest not using any armor piercing as the ranks strength bonus should be enough and if the unit is used as originally intended , as a melee unit, then they should be in 3 or more ranks anyway.

If you do anything at least put in the basic weapon profile, I've found leaving that out of the RH rules really screwed with novice players minds as they seem to think the blunderbuss is something other than a gun with a range and a strength.