2000pt Khorne MSU tell me what you think??

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Re: 2000pt Khorne MSU tell me what you think??

Postby Bauhaus » Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:07 am

Some of the comments above are crap of course. Don't listen to the Khorne equals lose control of your army debate. In theory it might be true, but I've only played a few players that can actually do anything about it (screw you Andy!)

A better way of putting it is that you cant control your army enough to adapt to every situation. You're left with some fairly simple choices maybe too simple at times to really get the job done.

I've tried the all cav Khorne list a few times and it never has worked the way us devotees of Khorne would hope.

1) As already mentioned too few units. With Khorne its not the size of the unit but the number.

2) Cavalry the hammer needs infantry the anvil to really be effective. Youve only got the hammer sort of, see 3.

3) Khorne knights cant flank. They are frenzied. They want to charge right in.

4) War hounds do what?

So, I would suggest thinking about:


1) Khorne only armies are a bit too much of a good thing. Undivided/Khorne is much better.

2) Units of rank and file Khorne Warriors. I dont have point costs with me but 2 or 3 units of 10 warriors (2 ranks) with full command (and maybe a war banner) would be nice. Marauders could also be used for this purpose (and often times are. Id actually prefer warrior though just because.) There job is to make the anvil so I would tool them for defense rather than offense (they still need to get CR by fighting though - they're giving up 2 ranks and outnumber to start.)

3) Units of undivided cavalry. 1 chosen. 1 or 2 is enough. Put an undivided hero(s) in the unit(s) if desired but see 5.

4) Nothing wrong with furies, but it is a mortal army. 6 to 8 are usuallly more than enough for this purpose - not 10.) Most players love to have these guys for going after war machines but Im not so sure Id put them in this army. You really need to spend points on bolstering both your hammer and your anvil to get this army to work. *I'd probably leave them in just to go after mages and war machines, but if I needed the points elsewhere....

5) At 2250 you can add a Hell Cannon (or maybe the furies?)

6) Heroes with MoKs really like chariots IMHO.

7) Likewise I have no problem with the lord on dragon. You should realize that many players will have a problem however. I think dragons will be appearing more often in 7th edition than they did in 6th so Id probably go for it. He easily makes up for your lost cavalry units. He could also be undivided giving you more flexibility with him.

Id deploy on a flank (using the table) and move the chariots and warriors forward towards the enemy line. Id attempt to punch through with the knights while the dragon immediately outflanks the army. You will really need to come up with some deployment concepts and push the units really hard. Magic and shooting may still be too much for this army.
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Re: 2000pt Khorne MSU tell me what you think??

Postby -Jarrett » Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:22 am

So basically Dave said what we said, the list wont work so drop the pure khorne nonsense and mix it up.

Khorne does equal lose control of your army, if your opponent a) knows what he is doing and b) has units to draw you off. If your opponent has a) down he's probably got b) available.

A chaos lord on a dragon is fine but I just don't see burdening him with frenzy. Make him undivided and he's free to do as you please.

I agree that you don't need 3 units of knights. Perhaps 1 undivided chosen, 1 khornate, both 5 strong.

Not so sure about the khorne warriors. They're really pricey, and 1 rank and a standard does not add much in the way of res. If you want static res get marauders, otherwise get some chariots to go in the front with the knights.

Beast herds are awesome and give you some screening/mobility. Much better than the hounds for the cost.

Marauder horsemen and moreso centigaurs are also solid choices for the points.

The hell cannon is incredibly nasty. Not sure how you'll fit it
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Re: 2000pt Khorne MSU tell me what you think??

Postby Ring87 » Wed Feb 14, 2007 2:22 am

Bezerker sword fits the theme and gives allot of extra attacks when the character is mounted on a demonic steed, chariot, or Dragon. I used centigors in my list. Cheap, st5 & st4 on the charge and they move through trees.

The mixed list is the best.
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Re: 2000pt Khorne MSU tell me what you think??

Postby Bauhaus » Wed Feb 14, 2007 2:28 am

Jarrett, you are more than welcome anytime to show my how youll gain control of my Khorne Legion.

I assume hes trying to make something that looks and plays like an all Khorne Cavalry army. Beastmen and marauders are for pussies like Tzeenich and Slannish (and for manly all Khorne Beastmen armies such as my next army!)

But,

The thing about expensive foot soldiers is that:

1) You dont want to waist points on multiple ranks (they cost too much per rank).

2) You dont want them in a single combat against large blocks of rank and file for long. Theyll eventually succumb to CR.

3) You want them to form your main battle line. They need to stick around and hold the enemy in position long enough for your heavy cav to get into position to flank/negate rank bonuses etc.

4) You cant afford to have them succumb to magic/shooting reducing there number. Banners, shields, MR that help in this regard are usually pretty important.

5) They are a challenge to use but I think theyre more in keeping with your idea than any of the other choices offered.

Ive had pretty good success with small units of 10 bloodletters with full command. I think they match up comparably to warriors (or at least thats my assumption.)

I might be biased but Ive always tried to make a Khorne mortal list like my demon list (I know, I know.)

The comparison:

Bloodthirster/Lord (Undivided on Dragon)
Bloodcrushers/Chosen Chaos Knights Undivided
Bloodcrushers/Chaos Knights Undivided
Bloodletters/Chaos Warriors MoK
Bloodletters/Chaos Warriors MoK
Bloodletters/Chaos Warriors MoK
Flesh Hounds/Furies
Flesh Hounds/War hounds
Chariot of Khorne/two Chariots MoK with Heros

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Re: 2000pt Khorne MSU tell me what you think??

Postby -Jarrett » Wed Feb 14, 2007 5:22 am

I'd be happy to show you how I'd handle your Khorne Daemon legion Dave. Let's do it whenevr next possible
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Re: 2000pt Khorne MSU tell me what you think??

Postby Amazonwarlord » Wed Feb 14, 2007 11:58 am

That's a game I'd like to watch ... a week from Tomorrow sound good?
"I have not failed, I've just found ten thousand ways that won't work." – Thomas Edison
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Re: 2000pt Khorne MSU tell me what you think??

Postby -Jarrett » Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:55 pm

Ideally I'll be playtesting Eldar, but maybe not. ASAP and we'll let you know Leah
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Re: 2000pt Khorne MSU tell me what you think??

Postby -gjnoronh » Wed Feb 14, 2007 10:27 pm

Frenzy doesn't take the generalship portion out of the game for either side of the table.

You need to be a good general to handle frenzy, but after 2 years of competitive play with my khorne/nurgle DL I can count on one hand the number of charges I was forced to make against my will (and I never had troops pulled away from the main battle line.)

If the guy across the table is better than you - then they'll beat you, and one army being frenzied or not doesn't change that. Frenzy limits some tactic options but doesn't change the fact warhammer is a brain matchup.

Some advice posts on the DL forum regarding frenzy
z7.invisionfree.com/wyrml...wtopic=945

z7.invisionfree.com/wyrml...owtopic=23

z7.invisionfree.com/wyrml...topic=1491

On the DL forum there are some other comments you might find useful on making a khorne list.

Gary
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