Empire army list

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Re: Empire army list

Postby -poxous » Sat Jan 27, 2007 2:59 pm

Empire doesn't need big nasty stuff or all knights to win. Empire has pulled a few overalls/best generals in the last few years with pretty balanced lists. The new empire list will do as good or better w/o cheedar.

And compy armies are not dead. It just depends on who shows up with harder armies... if everyone likes them then hard armies get a free pass.
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Re: Empire army list

Postby AndyP » Sat Jan 27, 2007 7:42 pm

Quote:
But Matt is right about one thing: play an army that not only ignores traditional linnear tactics, but also turns them into an achilles heel, and five ranked units coming across the board isn't something to be feared so much as an opportunity for selecting a good weak point and butchering the opposing army into segments.



You shouldn't listen to Wormtongue Birdoff, John. Armies based on ranked infantry can (and do) win games against these non-linear armies.

Throughout 6th and 7th editions, I've witnessed the change in tournament armies towards these skirmishy units. I've still stuck with armies based around ranked infantry and (on the whole) I've still done pretty well.* My tactics and support units have changed slightly to accommodate the change in opponent's armies, but the core of my armies have stayed very similar. As any of the boardmongers who have played me will tell you, I'm not an especially brilliant general** - I've just stuck to my guns and learnt to deal with the different challenges I face.


Andy P

* and we're talking about something like 200 tournament opponents, so not a small sample size.

** some will tell you I'm a lucky bastard, some will just omit the lucky part.
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Re: Empire army list

Postby -the black prince » Sat Jan 27, 2007 8:53 pm

heh john: you playing warhammer again?! :) :) :)

I'm playing with some empire lists as well, and like jarret's idea of an infantry line. I'm planning a couple of big units of greatswords to make my line stubborn, as well as have infantry troops that can actually do some damage. With stubbborn, 4+ save and gt weapons, ld 8 (?) and only 10 points apiece these guys seem a great deal.

You're almost there with your greatswords.
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Re: Empire army list

Postby KevinC » Sat Jan 27, 2007 10:48 pm

How did this topic turn into taking dragons is about 'cheese, winning and only viable options'?

Infantry armies are viable options and many different builds with Empire in particular make for good competitive armies. But I don't think this is the point of John's thread.

It seems John is simply fed up with his infantry armies (for whatever reasons) and he wants to try doing something different (compared to the armies he is use to fielding). So taking a dragon is not about being cheesy for whatever it's about having fun with a very dangerous large monster!

I never understood the problem people have with dragons, greater daemons and other large monster. I always enjoy fighting against them! This is fantasy after all and just like Larry or someone said they can all die first turn!

John, I can bet you that taking a dragon with your Empire army will be very unquie choice and a refreshing change to other Empire armies. Just check out Warhammer-Empire.com no one there will even considered taking the imperial dragon. Go with the dragon have fun with it and create a new style Empire army!

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Re: Empire army list

Postby Ring87 » Sun Jan 28, 2007 12:01 am

Sorry about the "cheese" word its so passe'. I was just adding to the post before. By all mean take the Dragon. I would find it both challenging and satisfying to break and run down the emperior of mankind:b .

I like playing different armies. Special characters can be fun as long as the don't disrupt the normal game flow.

The bsb with stubborn banner, some greatswords, and some nutters would be a solid core to stick the enemy while your dragon runs rampant on a flank. Plus it will be harder for oppenets to get those points if they ignore your dragon.
The Hellblaster is still viable as well.
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Re: Empire army list

Postby mattbird » Sun Jan 28, 2007 12:52 am

Quote:
Wormtongue Birdoff


ouch baby. very ouch.

Andy, your armies have some infantry backed up by more hitty and maneuvre stuff. The standard 'TVI' empire army is primarily infantry, with very little hitty or maneuvre stuff. It's that kind of army I find obsolete. Yours are still viable- in fact, they are pretty silimar to my usual builds, with 2-3 low value infantry blocks
jer732 wrote:Birdoff makes me want to rage quit life
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Re: Empire army list

Postby elrodogg » Sun Jan 28, 2007 1:21 am

It's really funny to see every single person say that a couple of blocks of infantry in a balanced empire army is a viable option so many different ways.

If I were building an empire army, it wouldn't have ranked infantry at all. 2 steam tanks, 2 cannons, 30 handgunners, 2 priests, archlector, level 2, and as many cav of diff varieties as points permit. Good thing I hate painting horses. :D
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Re: Empire army list

Postby -Jarrett » Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:47 am

Bah, Ronen! Comp can make or break you at a tournament, so that army would just get dinged to death.

Comp isn't dead except for official GTs, which are the tournaments people are least excited about. Clearly you've played too much Tau, yipes!

John, obviously you can go whatever route you like. As I said to you previously, I think combined arms is the best approach for most armies, and of late I tend towards fewer big point investments, so I keep the standard count down and take a lot of units. Infantry don't win games by themselves - I really don't recall this utopian warhammer where they ever did. I think most people find they have a home in almost any army, and I think - always have - infantry-heavy is viable.

You can't go wrong with a dragon if that's what mood you're in. I think it would be good for you to see the strengths and weaknesses of such a point-intensive investment, having always found yourself on the other side of the table of such things. That said, you're still going to be able to put plenty on the board and overall I think you'll find Empire is just better, whichever approach you take.

"...and wood elves, skinky lizardmen, monster island lizardmen, bretonnia, vampires, tomb kings, Khorne Legion, sea guard, nurgle legion..."

We've got no woodies at the club, no vamps of late, nor Bretonnians, Nidals sea guard is a joke, and nobody does "skinky" lizardmen (not even sure what this is really, 5+ units of skinks?). I don't do monster lizards either even though you've sworn I did at some point (with models I don't own). You sir, are a madman. ;)
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Re: Empire army list

Postby AndyP » Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:49 am

Matt, I take back the wormtongue comment - it's just that you've been playing Tzeentch for so long that I can't help seeing you as a tricksy trickster.

I'm not convinced that our armies are similar (due to character selection), but I do agree that the TVI style of army isn't ideal. I'll never get to try it though as I'm unlikely to ever get that many minis painted.

Andy P
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Re: Empire army list

Postby -Jarrett » Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:57 am

Wormtongue
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