Dark Elf List Builds

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Dark Elf List Builds

Postby -LLagroue » Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:47 am

Hey Everyone,

I am curious, what is the arguably the toughest or the elements needed for the toughest build for a 2,250 Dark Elf tournament List?

My debate-
Does it include 2 chariots and 2 scout units, 3 chariots and 1 scout unit, or 4 chariots?
Does it include a dragon rider or heavy magic with 8+ power dice?
Does it include more than 2 RBTs?

Any thoughts?

Lance
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Re: Dark Elf List Builds

Postby VectorAWX3 » Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:58 am

My thoughts are the anything considered the toughest list is absolutely not the best tournament list. Which would you prefer? ;)
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Re: Dark Elf List Builds

Postby -LLagroue » Fri Dec 22, 2006 10:31 am

Go with the best tournament list imaginable. ;)
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Re: Dark Elf List Builds

Postby -Jarrett » Fri Dec 22, 2006 11:25 am

4 RBTs isn't going to win you games - I think one, maybe two is best for nailing priority targets, while not dedicating tons of points to two crew machines (and possibly running out of fire lanes). Dark riders are great bang for the buck as I'm sure you know. A dragon obviously has many uses too - can't go wrong there I think. Dark Elves do medium magic decent (and you need at least some just for the dispel).
I'd say of the options you listed 3 chariots and one scout unit probably works best. The scouts are pricey, single purpose, and you're looking for punch.

Edit: Why don't you post what you were thinking
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Re: Dark Elf List Builds

Postby VectorAWX3 » Fri Dec 22, 2006 11:39 am

DE scouts are great. They get repeater x-bows, and can basically start as short range! Between them and a unit of dark riders and a long-range RBT, you can kill off a fast-cav enemy unit in the first turn of the game and force all sorts of unfortunate panic-checks. They are NOT single purpose! Match block, pepper light units, hunt war-machines, hunt loose light characters.

To me, the more you mix an army, the more fun and flexible it becomes. That's what makes the best tourney list. Nobody will fault you for taking 2 chariots. They probably won't fault you for taking 3. Take 4, and you may well be "that guy with all the chariots".

Listen, RBT's are excellent for various uses, but pricy. You don't need one, but it's not going to kill you. Shades are excellent. Harpies are great war-machine hunters if you can keep them away from enemy fire for a turn. Dark riders may be the best fast-cav in the game. RXB warriors with a 4+ save are very nice. (ranked, shooting at large targets, they're fantastic). Spearmen are nice and relatively cheap for what they do. Characters have a wide range of magic items.

Look.. I'm of no help. I like it all. :p

And for a twist, go Cult-Of-Pleasure for a whole different twist.

I'm worse than no help. :lol
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Re: Dark Elf List Builds

Postby -LLagroue » Sat Dec 23, 2006 12:34 am

Thanks Jarret&Nidal for your thoughts

My conceptual DE Design thus far-

Heroes:
????

Core:
2 units of 20 spearmen with standard. (170 pts each)
2 units of 10 crossbowmen (110 each)
2 units of 5 dark riders (90 pts each)
2 units of 5 dark riders with xbows (120 pts)

Special-
3 chariots- crew armed spears and xbows
1 unit of 5 shades- 70 pts

Rare-
2 RBTs
Total so far 1571


Hero options I like thus far-
A horse mounted BSB with standard of slaughter (+d3 combat res)

I guess the big question is what character combo would best serve this list.
Some options:
Lord on manticore, mounted bsb, 2 mages
Lord on manticore, 3 mages
Level 4 mage, lev. 2 mage, hero on Pegasus, mounted bsb
Lord on manticore, mounted bsb, hero on Pegasus, scroll caddy.
Lord on Dragon with 2 lev.2 mages
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Re: Dark Elf List Builds

Postby -Jarrett » Sat Dec 23, 2006 1:34 am

Shades do scouting shit well, period. They're not like dark riders, for example, which can also go nab a flank.

I never said they were bad, they just aren't something I'd duplicate given elf point costs and the other options he has.

I like the core of this list so far. It's very shooty, so you might consider some beef in the character department. I'd endeavour to squeeze in more xbows for the dark riders. There's also the Lord on manticore, pegasus rider, 2 lvl 2 option. I think you go with what suits your taste. What would you most like to paint up? How important is having a solid magic phase to you?
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Re: Dark Elf List Builds

Postby VectorAWX3 » Sat Dec 23, 2006 3:08 am

Lord on dragon/2level2's sounds very mean. :evil x-bows on the chariots are an afterthought. x-bows on dark riders are practically mandatory considering how good fleeing/rallying/shooting now work for fast cav (4 units may be too much.. 3 may be better).

Do the shades have RxB's? If not, get them!!!!!!

Jarrett, shades are AWESOME!!!! RxB's!!!!!!!!! They can put out 10 shots!!!!!

I'm not crazy about the two spearmen units of minimal-size-for-rank-bonus. I'd rather put a slightly bigger unit (to go 7 wide) and use some points elsewhere. Give musicians to everyone, if you haven't done so already. Champs aren't uber-useful in spearman units, but they look cool painted up, so I include them. :)

Oh.. and 2 RBT's... bleh. To me, RBT's are the most boring war-machine out there. They're fine and useful and all but... well.. they're boring. That's just my opinion. I'd drop one for another unit of shades. :)
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Re: Dark Elf List Builds

Postby mannahnin » Sat Dec 23, 2006 3:50 am

A guy name of Ash used to play regularly at the Harvard Square GW and at Danger Planet in Mass with Dark Elves. Good player; took 2nd at the Boston GT with the DE, which is a lot better than most folks expect DE to do.

I played him a couple of times, and his lists were similar. I dont think I saw him use more than one RBT. Mostly infantry, a few shades, 2-3 units of Dark Riders, some Cold One Chariots, and 2-3 heroes mounted on Dark Steeds to give HtH support wherever it was needed and/or to kill light skirmishy units and war machines on their own. I always saw him use defensive to mid-magic. Either scroll caddie, two L2s, and at one point he was experimenting with a L3. Very good bait and flee/ semi-MSU style of play, but with a little more rank bonus, which did pretty nicely in combination with chariots and the occasional hero.
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Re: Dark Elf List Builds

Postby robk » Sat Dec 23, 2006 8:53 am

I'm not going to critque your list but just have a few thoughts.
First off 2 chariots take 1 special slot.

I have not used a RBT but my feeling is that one might be alright but a unit of RXB warriors does a better job for a little more expensive.
Get shields and musicians for all your units (Especially mus for dark riders and shield for all warriors)
I've tried the xBows on chariots and didn't like it. But thats total feel. Just a few shots to do that extra wound to force panic so your 10 RxB units don't have to waste shots.
In terms of Dark Riders I think having one unit without RxB's I think its fine there are uses for them but with 2 it might be tough to be effective.
You might consider having Stds for a couple of your Dark Riders. I'm thinking about adding it.

Shades are terrific, I use a unit of 6 as pumping out 12 shots is easy to figure and if I charge them into H2H they usually take 1 wound. I might bump them up to 7 but not sure I have the points.

I really think with magic proliferation all elves require either 5 Dice/2 Scrolls or 4 dice/3 scrolls. Its just too easy for someone to make your units ineffective. (Except if you are mainly infantry as they can soak up fire better).
I have 4 dice/2 scrolls and I have a really hard time against any army with some magic (Even 2 lvl 2 mages give me fits).
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